We haven’t traditionally engaged in a lot of trade speculation in these parts. As such, the goal of the preceding exercise wasn’t so much to lob spitballs as it was to get a price check on the rights to sign Blake Griffin — and have a little fun with the appraisal process. Think of Blake Griffin/#1 pick as the house you own, love, and have every intention of living in until the kids are grown. If asked, “Would you sell the house?” your answer would reflexively be, “No. It’s not for sale,” which it’s not. But what if someone were willing to overpay wildly for it?
There are some good reasons to be ecstatic over the prospect of Griffin in a Clippers’ uniform, and there are also reasons to be a little cautious. Over the next few weeks, we’ll be breaking down Griffin’s on-court assets and liabilities on both ends of the floor. Oklahoma has produced some talented basketball players over the years: Mark Price, the late Wayman Tisdale, Alvan Adams, (and Bryant Reeves, too). Barring catastrophic injury, Oklahoma City native Blake Griffin will most likely join the list, and you have to imagine that a franchise in the NBA’s smallest market — a franchise that happens to be in need of big man – just might be willing to compensate the team holding Griffin’s rights a king’s ransom to get a hometown hero in uniform, on billboards, and out into the community. On the other hand, there’s little in Sam Presti’s history as a strategist to suggest that he’d factor in a variable like where a player happened to play his amateur ball into any transaction.
With that, let’s take a look at some of the offers the Naçión would deem acceptable for the pick, starting with Oklahoma City as the trading partner and D.J. Foster as our ceremonial GM:
OKC Receives:
Baron Davis (12.1/4yr)
LAC 2009 1st round pick (1st overall) -Blake GriffinLAC Receives:
Earl Watson (6.6/1yr)
Jeff Green (3.5/1+1yr)
Thabo Sefolosha (2.7m/1yr)
OKC 2009 1st round pick (3rd overall)- Ricky Rubio
2010 1st round pick VIA Phoenix SunsWhy this works for LAC:
The Clippers get to dump Baron Davis and his lengthy contract, freeing up the starting spot for PG Ricky Rubio. The Clippers also get a valuable expiring contract in Earl Watson, and two young, defensive minded players in Green and Sefolosha. By dumping Baron, the Clippers guaranteed contracts would total only 15 million in two years. In addition to cap flexibility, the 2010 Suns pick is unprotected and could very well become a top 10 pick considering Phoenix’s troubles and the inevitable fire sale on the horizon. The trio of Rubio, Gordon, and Green are all under the age off 22 and Thornton, Sefolosha and Camby (if he’s not traded) could instantly become one of the better second units in basketball.
Why this works for OKC:
The Thunder get hometown kid Blake Griffin, who would immediately create tons of interest around the team and sell plenty of jerseys. The 3-4 combination of Durant and Griffin could immediately become one of the best in the league. The trade allows Russell Westbrook to move off the ball and embrace his inner Monta Ellis playing next to Baron Davis. Davis and his lengthy contract are a risk, but with Oklahoma City being pretty low on the desired free agent location totem pole, he might be one of the best players they could get. A starting 5 of Baron, Westbrook, Durant, Griffin and Krstic would most likely lead the Thunder to the playoffs- which would be a nice bargaining tool to keep Durant in OKC.
Why this might not work:
This trade would have to be done after the draft, as Memphis could actually select Rubio and ruin everything. Out of the two teams, Oklahoma City would be most likely to blink first. Sam Presti is a brilliant general manager, and using his valued cap space to take a chance on Baron doesn’t sound like something he would do.
Henry Abbott has published a caveat emptor on Rubio that’s well worth a read and serves as a reminder than any reservations we might have about Griffin’s can’t-miss potential have to be applied even more carefully to Rubio. Disclaimers aside, there’s some wisdom to a deal like this if you feel that replacing Davis with a dynamic, long-term prospect at the PG is a noble goal. Watson is a confounding player whose adjusted +/- numbers have been strong throughout his career, even though his offensive limitations drive you nuts. He’d buy Rubio a year of acclimation and begin to address some of the weak on-ball defense. Meanwhile, the Clippers could turn the page on Baron Davis, retain Camby and Kaman as chips for additional retooling, get the defensive flexibility they need with Sefolosha, move Thornton to the bench where he belongs as an energy scorer, and get another forward who can facilitate — albeit one not without weaknesses — in Jeff Green. The deal would almost certainly leave the franchise is a better place. It would also be far riskier than drafting Griffin and just tweaking around the margins.
Moving beyond Oklahoma City, Zhiv asks a daring question: Is it possible to retain Griffin, and still acquire Rubio for the long term? Zhiv turns his eyes toward Memphis:
The deal I like best right now is to try to make a trade with Memphis (one that doesn’t include the #1 pick) to get the #2 pick, so that the Clips could draft both Griffin and Rubio. It would mean giving up Kaman or Randolph, and taking back Jaric and Darko, but it would work. I’d rather take the risk with Griffin rather than adding to the deal to get Rudy Gay, and making a big time swap to end up with Gasol and Gay and Rubio while giving up Griffin and big men doesn’t make much sense to me. And I think that Randolph is a better fit than Kaman in Memphis — let them keep Gasol.
The task of swapping bad contracts is an art, and one that good franchises manage with finesse. Memphis is a fiscally-minded franchise right now and zhiv’s deal would allow them to dump their two worst contracts. Though they’d get a bloated contract back in Randolph, he’d give them offensive production at the position where they need the most help. I’m with zhiv on the matter of Rudy Gay who, though more talented than Al Thornton, presents some similar problems at the 3. The Clippers, meanwhile, would be trading cultural dead weight for basketball dead weight — an acceptable exchange for a team looking to clear minutes in the frontcourt, get younger, and become more defensive-minded.
Trapp has also put together some ingenious three-way deals involving Washinton that enable the Clippers to retain the #1 pick.
The Clippers will probably listen to offers for Griffin, but the most likely transactions this summer are deals that involve existing players. As Zhiv writes:
I’m approaching the trade machine by 1)looking for teams that need a PF like Randolph (Memphis, OKC, Milwaukee, Chicago); 2) teams that need a center like Kaman (OKC, Charlotte, Minnesota. Indiana, Chicago); 3) bigger deals that might involve either or both of those players, or Camby, BDavis, DJordan or Thornton. So it’s a stretch to think of deals for Griffin and the #1 pick.
In this spirit, Seth touches on a couple of deals I’d like to see, one of which involves the Chicago Bulls, the Clippers’ most likely trading partner this summer:
Trade #1: Kaman to the Bulls for Kirk Hinrich. The Bulls need a big man and Hinrich can back up Boomdizzle and Hinrich can play the SG and PG positions.
I’ll go one further than Seth: Hinrich can defend SFs, as we witnessed in the Celtics-Bulls series when he was on the floor with Derrick Rose and Ben Gordon, doing solid work on Paul Pierce. It’s not a deployment tactic you’d use every night, but Hinrich would offer the kind of flexibility defensively the Clippers desperately need on the perimeter. If Baron disappears, Hinrich is more than capable of stepping in. In fact, he’d look great next to Eric Gordon, whose penetration would give Hinrich a boatload of spot-up opportunities. If Gordon got hurt for any extended period, Hinrich does stellar work off the ball. He’s a 40% three-point shooter, hits 44% of his 2-point jump shots, and plays with a level of grime (watch those borderline screens from Hinrich) the Clippers could use as they rebuild.
The idea that the Clippers should behave conservatively solely to escape the “only the Clippers could screw this up” rap is misguided. They’re going to be ridiculed no matter what they do, which is all the more reason they shouldn’t act out of fear. It’s more than likely that selecting and developing Blake Griffin as their power forward of the future is the best course of action — but that should be the reason the Clippers draft him.
53 Responses
The Hinrich/Kaman trade would be great for both teams, but it assumes the Bulls are going to resign Ben Gordon. I’m not a big enough Bulls fan to know what the situation is there, but it doesn’t look as though both parties are completely enamored with each other. If the Bulls let Gordon go, it’s hard to see them moving Hinrich without getting another quality guard in return. And with the Bulls having Salmons now, Gordon looks ready to bolt. At that point, a combo guard to back up both Salmons and Rose is a necessity (aka Hinrich). A Hinrich/Kaman seems like a slam dunk in terms of the quality of players, but doesn’t really take the Bulls overall needs into question. Any Bulls fans out there who can shed some light?
bongstradamus Reply:
May 25th, 2009 at 1:24 pm
It looked to me like the Salmons move was made at the deadline because they had no plans on re-signing Gordon. They can keep Salmons for 2 more years at the same price they are paying Gordon today.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 12:49 pm
I would love for the clips to be picking 1 and 2 – can’t miss.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 1:51 pm
Sometimes the best trades are the ones not made
Only trade I would go for is the Kaman/Hinrich trade.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 1:52 pm
Hinrich is a great leader and team player, something the Clippers need. If we get Hinrich, we will get that leadership back that we once had with Cuttino Mobley. An unselfish player who will take on starting or bench roles without causing a stir with the coaching staff and teammates. I agree with you Mr. Arnovitz, like Mobley, Hinrich is a good defender that can guard a PG, SG, and SF. He takes good shots and can be a playmaker.
As for Rubio, I don’t dislike his skills and I know he has a lot of potential, but besides Gordon and Thornton, when we draft with the idea of ‘potential’ we have not been successful. Korolev, Livingston, and Olowokandi are a few examples of ‘potential’ but they became a bust (Livingston can be successful if healthy). If Rubio had the hype like CP3 or Deron Williams, I would totally go for the idea of drafting a PG, but I don’t see that in him. For example, the last time we had the #1 pick, Olowokandi had the ‘potential’ and Mike Bibby was the player that was ready to play and lead a team. Guess what happened, we chose the “Kandi-man” and his career wasn’t that sweet.
Baron Davis is a veteran and he is capable of having a great season (if he has the career with us like he had in Golden State, we would not be hating on him as much most fans are). He has 1 season as a Clipper under his belt and it wasn’t successful, but we should definitely give him another shot. When we do draft Blake Griffin and hopefully add some solid vetarans (Hinrich), I’m sure that the 2009-2010 Clippers team can post 45+ wins.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 2:01 pm
Typical clipper reaction. Something great happens to it and we spend the next month trying to fuck it up. Just draft griffin. Geez.
btc Reply:
May 25th, 2009 at 2:17 pm
Adding to that. What makes any of you think this management would get a good deal back?
That’s why you draft Blake. Of all the possibilities he’s the safest.
MC Reply:
May 25th, 2009 at 2:55 pm
Dude, chill out. These are all hypotheticals
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 2:15 pm
Rubio, Griffin and Gordon as a core would be awesome. By all accounts they are all hard working “character” guys which we could definitely use more of. I would happily build around that instead of Zach and Baron.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 2:20 pm
Amen to the Hinrich trade.
Trading for Rubio is OK if you don’t give up either Gordon or Griffin. All you need is three great players on a team to win a championship if they are supported by players who are smart and hard working with average talent. with Gordon and Griffin, the Clips may be two-thirds of the way there as to great players.
Time is on the Clips side. Gordon and Griffin will continue to develop into possible greatness. The Clips will get a high lotto draft pick from MN in the next three years. They will have large expiring overpriced contracts over the next three years as well. Thornton, DJ, Novak, Collins, and Taylor may continue to improve.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 2:45 pm
I prefer making a deal with Memphis. Id love to see Rubio, Griffin and Gordon become our big three. Whatever we have to do to make that happen id be cool with. Get those 3 together.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 3:04 pm
Wow–I thought I was just kibitzing and wasn’t expecting a bump since I wasn’t coming up with a Blake Griffin trade. Always just one of those kids who gets assignments mixed up, incapable of writing the 5 paragraph essay, but sometimes it works. Just like trading Randolph to Memphis: so crazy it just might work! One thing I like about it is that the Clips keep BDavis, giving Rubio a couple of years to come around. And is it just me (I’m pretty sure it is), but doesn’t Jaric, who is dead weight in the Memphis deal, remind anyone of Kurt Hinrich? On Hinrich and Kaman, I’m not sure I’m ready to end my Kaman Studies, which have been so challenging and amusing over the years, and Hinrich seems like he was a valuable playoff piece that Chicago wouldn’t be too willing to give up, especially if Jackgroove is right about resigning Ben Gordon. Shipping out Kaman–which I’m sure would be the right thing to do, but I still fear it somehow–means that the Clips have Camby for one year, ZBo for two, with Griffin and DJordan rising. I worry that Kaman is the only offensive threat in the group, aside from Randolph, who wouldn’t seem to be a good fit on the court with Griffin. But all of this is the fun of speculating. What about Randolph for Richard Jefferson? Are we having fun yet?
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 4:12 pm
I’d love trading Kaman for Hinrich, but as mentioned, Chicago has to resign Gordon or it’s all a mute point. This is, I’m not sure Chicago would want Kaman, he’s been injured this last year and value may not be that high, that trade would be a total steal for the Clippers even though it’s trading a starter for a back-up. Chicago may be more interested in 1 year contract defensive rebounding option of Camby. He can take on Garnett or Zydrunas and give them more cap flexibility for the fuiture, and even help out with signing Gordon because they’ll have more money to give next year when Camby is off the books (a stretch, i know, but anything to get Hinrich). Sadly, I think after the great playoffs of 09, Chicago needs Hinrich as much as we want him. But the deal would work financially as well with it being Camby for Hinrich.
Chris. Reply:
May 25th, 2009 at 5:14 pm
plus, and this may be crazy, but getting Hinrich would be a dream for all 3 back-up spots as mentioned, that if Chicago wanted something more than just Camby or Kaman, I’d go so far as to trade Minnesota’s future pick we have with Chicago’s first round 26 pick this year. It would save Chicago money they’d have to sign the player to and could give to re-sign Ben Gordon and get a great pick in the future, while we’d get Hinrich who can play DEFENSE, which is what we need, and can help us win now, plus a cheap late first round draft pick to fill a void we need now.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 5:06 pm
Comments from the Bulls front office seem to lean toward signing Ben Gordon, especially after his big time play during the Boston series. If we can pull off that Kaman for Heinrich trade, the Clippers would go a long ways in getting alot of STH back next year. Alot of folks seem to have no faith left in Baron.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 5:11 pm
“And is it just me (I’m pretty sure it is), but doesn’t Jaric, who is dead weight in the Memphis deal, remind anyone of Kurt Hinrich?”
Jaric and Hinrich have exactly 2 things in common: Both are white and both play basketball. One of them does it rather A LOT better than the other. I think we all know who that is.
Kaman needs to go (I’ll gladly take Capt. Kirk for him) – we don’t need his limited offense with either Griffin or Z-Bo at the 4. Camby / Jordan / Skinner will do at C. Camby is excited about Griffin and is a great mentor to DJ (our C of the future) – he just may want to come back and be part of the Griffin/Gordon era if things look promising next season.
Can you dig it:
C – Camby / Jordan / Skinner
PF – Griffin /Randolph / Novak
SF – Thornton / Novak / ?
SG – Gordon / Hinrich / Ricky Davis / Collins
PG – Baron / Hinrich / Taylor
We do need to shore up the 3 spot though -if we can land a SF stud for Kaman – I’m down for that, too.
zhiv Reply:
May 25th, 2009 at 9:38 pm
Stian: I guess that among the things they don’t have in common is driving Lambourghinis and being married to Brazilian supermodels.
Hinrich is a hard-nosed, solid player, but he has had his ups and downs and his deal is not particularly good as far as everyday production is concerned.
I was simply pointing out that Jaric was overpaid by Minnesota, and the Clippers were overcompensated for his services (Cassell plus a #1 pick, rather than the Clips giving up a pick to get Cassell) for all of the same reasons that are being used to tout Hinrich. He can guard all three positions. He’s tough, and shows up on offense at some critical junctures. It’s funny how solid bench players can look great in the playoffs sometimes, and then they seem horrible when they go to weak teams.
Hinrich is paid too much money to be a backup, but then again BDavis makes too much money to be a mediocre starting PG. The Clips need to turn the tide and figure out a way to have guys playing hard, playing for something. That’s when guys like Baron, Hinrich, and even Jaric can shine.
I think you’re right, however, in saying that the Clips can move Kaman and be alright with Camby and DJordan, and Skinner as filler. But I think they can do better than Hinrich, rather than swapping bad contracts. He’s good insurance against a Baron Davis collapse and it’s not the worst deal out there, but perhaps the Clips can do better.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 5:15 pm
I like Hinrich but he makes a heck of a lot of money to come off the bench as a backup.
We need more help at the SF right now.
If we could somehow move Baron for an SF (even an overpaid one like Bobby Simmons) and get Hinrich… I’d look at that.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 7:59 pm
Any chance of trading with Atlanta? Baron, Kaman, and Thornton for Bibby and Joe Johnson?
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 11:28 pm
I think Hollinger’s idea of sending Randolph to Milwaukee for RJ is the sweetest deal we can get. We free up the PF spot for Griffin, get a real starting SF, and finally provide Al with a mentor (let’s face it, the kid probably has the worst basketball IQ of all NBAers).
Trading Baron when his value is at an all time low is not advantageous to the Clips. It’s true that he’s lost a step or two (or 5), but he is still a gifted PG who has extraordinary court-vision, and is most likely to have a bounce back year next season. With that said, the same goes for Kaman. In the beginning of last season, there were legitimate talks of trading Kaman for Gerald Wallace. If the Clips tried to offer that to Charlotte now, Charlotte would probably hang up the phone without even saying “bye.” I’d also hold on to Camby until at least the trade deadline, which will increase his trade value quite a bit.
A starting 5 of BD, EG, RJ, Griffin, and Kaman is theoretically a solid lineup that should be able to contend for a playoff spot (just like last years.. lol). If it doesn’t work out, then blow up the team midseason – trade Kaman, Camby, and BD for a boatload of draft picks or young players to build around the nucleus of EG and Griffin.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 11:40 pm
Hot off the OKC press…
http://newsok.com/trade-in-works-thunder-has-shot-at-blake-griffin/article/3372479?custom_click=masthead_topten
I wouldn’t want to see this deal through. Do we need another unproven, and potentially fragile point guard who is less athletic than Livingston and a bunch of future draft picks of mediocre talent at the 8, 9, or 10+ spot?
The problem with the Clippers has been that we have a lot of talent and no superstars, and we have a few players with questionable heart. Griffin has the potential to be a superstar and seems to have a major heart. Rubio offers a fair amount of doubt in these departments.
MC Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 12:15 am
“A point guard prodigy named Anfernee “Penny” Hardaway was also available.”
I stopped reading there.
MC Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 12:18 am
(Penny was never a great point is all I’m sayin)
Q.D. Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 7:54 am
Agreed.
This a trade from OKC writer. Of course, he’s going to write something in the thunders favor. Besides, he forgets to mention that Memphis has the 2nd pick and can really screw everyone.
Clippers keep the pick
bongstradamus Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 2:26 pm
Yea but the Clippers.com website does have both Rubio and Griffin on the season ticket package graphic though. That did make me scratch my head a little bit.
Posted on May 25th, 2009 at 11:42 pm
And he cited the clippers website for questions about the draft pick??
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 7:54 am
Regarding Hinrich and what I’ve been reading about the Mavs having interest in Baron and the Bulls looking to unload Tyrus Thomas……..here is a trade that might work for all sides:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=q28q6x
Clippers Get:
Kirk Hinrich
Josh Howard
Bulls Get:
Chris Kaman
Jerry Stackhouse (expiring)
Mavs Get:
Baron Davis
Tyrus Thomas
Al Thornton
Chris. Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 8:52 am
this oddly works but kinda scares me a bit too. Yes, Baron had a bad year with us, but I don’t think Hinrich is a better PG than him, I think our coach used him wrong. Yes, Hinrich would work better with Dunleavy, but I’d rather have another bad year with Dunleavy just to make sure he’s gone than try his whole ‘must win now’ to save his job approach. I think Josh Howard is fairly similar to Al, I do think we need to get rid of one of our ceneters so DJ can be the back-up and get more PT, but I think we could do a trade with the Bulls of either Camby or Kaman for Hinrich and use Hinrich as the 6th man and he can back-up either Davis or Gordon or Thorton. I’m not sure we need another year of a fire sale. I don’t want Dunleavy to have the option of again blaming it all on team chemistry and the guys not knowing each other.
D.J. Foster Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 1:22 pm
I love this trade, but it’s tough to see the Bulls pulling the trigger on that one. I don’t think that they get better on the court by swapping Kirk and Tyrus for Kaman and Stackhouse.
Robert BigWay Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 10:58 pm
You people must think that the Bulls are the Clippers or the Knicks.
We are not giving up 2 guys who actually play for 2 broken down overpaid slugs.
We already have $25 million in expiring contracts, and we are not ruining that by taking on 3 yrs at over $10 million per on Kaman, even if it were for expiring contracts only, never mind a quality player like Hinrich.
And Ty Thomas for Stackhouse is insane, except for a Clipper fan.
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 8:17 am
The Clippers need to do whatever it takes to keep Griffin, Eric Gordon, Al Thorton, and then add another top three pick for Rubio or even Thabeet. Having those four guys as your future isn’t bad at all. Then they just need to get a new coach.
http://therookiecontract.com/
bongstradamus Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 2:28 pm
Thabeet = Olowokandi 2.0. Im glad we never mention him as a possible draftee.
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 9:52 am
http://newsok.com/trade-in-works-thunder-has-shot-at-blake-griffin/article/3372479?custom_click=masthead_topten
Apparently Darnell Mayberry and I are thinking along the same lines here. In the trade I proposed I should have made it more clear that the deal would have to be done AFTER Oklahoma City picked to insure that we would be getting Rubio.
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 1:17 pm
I agree with a lot of the comments in this thread. Most of us have come to realize that we need help at the small forward position, and defensively we have to get better. Any trade that does take place needs to address one of these two areas, but preferably both.
With that being said, the Kaman for Hinrich deal makes a lot of sense.
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 1:29 pm
I think I speak for all Grizzlies fans when I say, HAHAHAAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Rubio, Jaric, and a $7 million expiring contract for Zach Randolph??!?
Are we talking about the same Zach Randolph?
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 3:18 pm
in no way do i want the clippers to give up having griffin for rubio. i’m with seth (comment #4) when he says drafting on “potential” hasn’t worked out for the clips. when korolev’s name was announced at the draft, i was frurious that the pick was wasted on this kid. I was never sold on shaun when he was healthy either. I fear that dumbleavy’s boner for foreign players is going to ruin having a bonafide force with star power on the roster for some kid that can’t shoot (like shaun) and will take years to be the complete PG needed. Why waste it? Trade Kaman! Am I the only one who really noticed all the potential DeAndre displayed to be a really good big man in this league during the season? He was a monster when he was given minutes! But as soon as special-ed kaman came back from injury, DeAndre was stuck on the bench. I’m sick of Kaman’s laziness. The only times he gets rebounds is when the ball falls into his hands. He doesn’t move as if his feet are cemented to the floor. I love the thought of gordon, griffin, and deandre being the future of the clippers. Give baron another chance to be the player we wanted him to be this past season. In that sense, we need a back up PG that can play well enough to give baron rest. If there are no bites for kaman, i’m even willing to trade camby to the knicks for nate robinson in a sign & trade. NY can only keep either David Lee or Nate, most likely Lee. So Camby will give them another expiring contract, and clips will get a servicable backup PG. DeAndre can provide the boards and blocks that camby does, with a cheaper contract and many years younger. As for z-bo, his contract is hard to move, if you only are willing to take back equal talent in return. But there will always be a taker if clips are willing to get less in return. I say go for it if it means freeing up PF for griffin to be the ROY and future. Let’s go Griffin in a clips uniform! Boo to rubio!
Ian Reply:
May 26th, 2009 at 11:04 pm
I hate it when people say things like “drafting on potential hasn’t worked out” and then trumpet some pure potential player like Deandre Jordan. Really? You can’t see the contradiction here? DJ has no post game and he doesn’t rebound or block shots at an elite level either. I can understand your frustration with Kaman, but lets be reasonable…
kenji Reply:
May 27th, 2009 at 12:26 am
Yes, lets be reasonable…DJ doesn’t rebound or block shots? How’s this:
12/22 vs TOR: PT 29min07sec; REB 8; BLK 3
01/19 vs MIN: PT 33min58sec; REB 10; BLK 6
01/21 vs LAL: PT 43min14sec; REB 12; BLK 4; PTS 23
01/25 vs GSW: PT 40min50sec; REB 20
01/26 vs POR: PT 26min37sec; REB 8 ; BLK 1
01/28 vs CHI: PT 24min27sec; REB 6; BLK 3
02/17 vs PHO: PT 21min38sec; REB 7; BLK 3
02/18 VS PHO: PT 36min03sec; REB 11; BLK 2
02/22 vs POR: PT 40min03sec; REB 12; BLK 3; PTS 15
03/03 vs MEM: PT 35min15sec; REB 9; BLK 4
03/07 vs IND: PT 25min53sec; REB 11; BLK 4
04/04 vs DEN: PT 25min03sec; REB 8; BLK 2; PTS 21
04/13 vs UTH: PT 28min38sec; REB 11; BLK 3; PTS 16
Seems to be that when he’s given at least 20mins he does in fact pull down boards and blocks. And these are the only games he got at least 20 minutes in. And thats just him as a rookie. Take a look at the stats for the other bigger name centers in the league and tell me if DJ didn’t pull down the boards and blocks they did when he got real playing time.
Ian Reply:
May 27th, 2009 at 6:46 pm
I do hope you noticed that all of the games that you posted were against up-tempo small ball teams….
kenji Reply:
May 27th, 2009 at 8:50 pm
i hope you noticed that those teams have the strong big men pulling down the boards and blocks you said DJ doesn’t do..also, not all those teams are small ball. Toronto? Utah? Sota? Lakers? Please, give me a break. You don’t know anything if you think those teams are small ball.
Ian Reply:
May 29th, 2009 at 12:50 am
Look at the game logs and who he plays against/how much they play/ how tall they are…. you’re silly
Seth Reply:
May 29th, 2009 at 7:27 pm
I think what Kenji meant was to not waste a good lottery pick on “potential”. That’s what I meant when I wrote my comment (#4). DeAndre has a great upside and he was taken in the 2nd Round. His “potential” looks much brighter than what Olowokandi had during his days and we didn’t have to waste a lottery pick on DeAndre.
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 10:41 pm
As a Bulls fan I can pretty much assure that the Bulls are not trading Hinrich for Kaman.
The main reason the Bulls have entertained trading Hinrich is to stay under the luxury tax if the resign Gordon.
Kamans contract is worse than Hinrichs, so the trade doesn’t meet the Bulls needs even before taking into account basketball considerations. Like Gordon bolting, or the fact that the Bulls have Noah at center, with Brad Miller as a backup for this season.
sorry, but the Clips don’t have anything that the Bulls want or need except of course the #1 pick.
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 10:52 pm
Yeah, i think all of the zbo hypotheticals are funny too. Especially ZBO to the Bucks. REALLY? Have we forgotten who coaches that team? Scott FUCKING Skiles. He and Zack would end up scrapping during their first practice. I don’t think any trades are happening, and i think that’s probably a good thing. I especially object to most of the trades suggested on this blog for the following reasons: 1) Kaman is young and reasonably paid (he’s injured often, but Camby’ll be gone in a year and we only have 2 serviceable Centers on the roster) 2) ZBOs contract is up in 2 years — can we please try to not take on a different terrible, LONGER contract in its place 3) Baron contract is really long, but he can still be a good player (he’s one year off of averaging like 20/8/2/5… if properly motivated he’s the kind of guy that can take a team to the next level).
As for the Rubio talk, one thing i’ve noticed about him from watching a few games and many highlight reels is that he’s NOT Shaun Livingston. The thing that always bothered me about Shaun was that he could make exceptional plays (the kind that only need to be made once every other game) but had a lot of trouble impacting games by making normal, PG plays. Rubio seems to be able to control the tempo and hit his guys pretty well (like a more up-tempo oriented version of Calderon). He’s got other big time problems that we should consider though. He’s unathletic, not particularly quick, can’t shoot a lick and is turnover prone (each of the first three things exacerbating the fourth problem). He’ll be able to run an offense and pick up assists, but there’s no guarantee that he’ll run the offense efficiently (especially if he never learns to shoot, as this often leads to overreaching and predictability), nor is there a guarantee that he’ll be able to consistently stay with some of the quickest PGs in the world (notwithstanding his solid D on CP3 in the olympics). I don’t think he’s capable of being a Shaun Livingston level disappointment but i also think that there’s a lot of risk there. I’d prefer Blake.
Posted on May 26th, 2009 at 11:00 pm
Would you trade the pick for Bosh? He’d be a better fit with either Kaman or Camby.
Posted on May 27th, 2009 at 12:45 pm
On behalf on Thunder fans everywhere, I would like to accept your trade offer for Griffin with just one adjustment- you can’t have Thabo. You can however, have Chucky Atkins. Atkins has an expiring contract for 3.4 million (to make the salaries even out) that carries a buy-out clause for $760,000. We get to keep our Swiss-connection and you guys get to trim a couple million in payroll. Deal?
D.J. Foster Reply:
May 27th, 2009 at 6:36 pm
Thabo’s ability to defend all wing scorers regardless of size is extremely valuable, and is something the Clippers simply don’t have. To give up pick 1, we’re going to need multiple players who can contribute right away. Chucky Atkins’ expiring contract is simply not big enough to justify acquiring him in place of someone who can contribute night in and night out.
If I’m still playing GM, I say NO DEAL! *Slams the window shut on the red button*
Steve H Reply:
May 27th, 2009 at 7:36 pm
Hoops hype projects the Clippers at 56mill in salary next year with just 10 players under contract. Are you sure you couldn’t use the two mill+ in salary relief you could get by buying Atkins out for 760K? Presti has authorized me to include a really nice fruit basket as part of the deal.
Posted on May 27th, 2009 at 2:35 pm
how’s the idea of trading Kirk Hinrich and Luol Deng for Randolph and maybe someone like Alex Acker or Ricky Davis
Posted on May 27th, 2009 at 8:22 pm
Ive been ready heavy on Blake and every where I read he is a franchise type player. He’s a coaches son. I mean the guy is coming out with a hat that says “Work” on the front. That is the antithesis to this recent Clipper team’s reputation. He is everything this franchise is not. ….He is coming with a better pedigree and work ethic then Dwight Howard. …he ….is my hero…he and Gordon. Seriously though. You can start with just those two alone and and create a fantastic core.
Blake is definately the way to go.
I would seriously only, at this point, consider trading for Howard or Lebron. Thats a bold statement, I know. But its about time this franchise makes a statement and stands on it.
Posted on May 28th, 2009 at 2:58 pm
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